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Got a new, young, furry love in your life? This is the place for you to ask all of your questions-big or small! Just remember that you are receiving advice from other dog owners and lovers... not professionals. If you have a major problem, always seek the advice of a vet or behaviorist! Most important is to remember to have fun with your new fur baby.
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bijou
simply the best |
 | | Barked: Mon Nov 12, '07 10:25pm PST | |  | |  | | Jack Russell Terriers are a type, or strain, of working terrier; they are not pure bred in the sense that they have a broad genetic make-up, a broad standard, and do not breed true to type. This is a result of having been bred strictly for hunting since their beginning in the early 1800's, and their preservation as a working breed since. The broad standard, varied genetic background based on years of restricted inbreeding and wide outcrossing, and great variety of size and type, are the major characteristics that make this strain of terrier known as a Jack Russell such a unique, versatile working terrier.
They are infact an English breed having been developed in Devon ( not Ireland) in the 1790's
I would question just how it is possible to trace these dogs pedigrees back to the 1800's- given the fact that these terriers have been outcrossed thoughout their history and there has not been a registration scheme in place for them as they have never been recognised as a breed by either the KC or the AKC ( and there fore have no recorded 'pedigree' to trace ).
This breeder is doing lots of things right and I fullly applaud her for this but some of her claims do not make sense in breeding terms - it's very easy to assert that you are breeding sound healthy dogs - but without test results you cannot KNOW that your stock is sound or indeed genetically healthy - all the pups she has produced willl still be fairly young dogs - at most they will be producing the 2nd or 3rd generation-she will need to have tested over several generations to be confident of her claims . DNA fingerprinting is just that - a means of identifying a dog - it can be useful tool to positively identify a dog with a problem ( such as epilepsy) and there fore eliminate him/her from your breeding lines but is not in itself a health check. |  |  | |  |
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bijou
simply the best |
| | Barked: Mon Nov 12, '07 11:29pm PST | | | | | | just looked at their website a little closer and they also have ( equally) 'unique and rare' Hunt terriers for sale-apparently also bred on 'ancient Irish lines' and with pedigrees that go back 100 years - and 'surprise surprise - they have had 4 litters bred between August and November this year !!!.
Sorry folks this just does not feel right - the public will always pay a premium for something that is described as rare or unique hence the fashion for 'rare' tea cup dogs or 'designer' crosses -this is just another string on the same bow - ask them to PROVE their ability to trace their dogs lineage back that far or indeed that they are any different from the thousands of bog standard JRT's bred each year - and I will happily eat my words !!!!.
Now I know I am an old curmudgeon and some of you find my views somewhat abraisive BUT I have many many years experience as a breeder and I'm telling you this breeders claims do not make sense . | | | | |
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Pugsley
I Might Be Small- But I Have It- All!
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| | Barked: Tue Nov 13, '07 6:34am PST | | | | | | bijou, do you take joy in belittling someone else's breeder? Because they aren't up to your standards, since ya know... you are the best breeder out there?
She has stated MANY times that she loves her breeder and that is her right, what right do you have to do nothing but talk bad about them and her breed? | | | | |
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Addy, CGC
Let's go for a- walk! |
| | Barked: Tue Nov 13, '07 6:46am PST | | | | | | Pugsley, Bijou hasn't said anything bad about the breed. Jack Russells are a working breed with a broader genetic base and more variability than is typical of KC/AKC recognized breeds. It's not an accident that JRTs aren't recognized, either; it's a deliberate choice.
As for the breeder: If she's doing real health checks, she doesn't say so on her site. This may be because the site is being renovated, but we won't know that until the information appears, or doesn't appear after a reasonable period of time. She's breeding far more litters than is typical of responsible breeders, too many litters a year for it to be anything other than commercial production of puppies for sale. Talking about "rare" strains/colors/types is nearly always a serious red flag, attempting to make a virtue of having dogs that aren't reasonably close to the generally recognized breed standard.
There's a lot about this breeder that looks good, but there's also a lot that, at the very least, raises some serious concerns. And saying to isn't being mean, or picking on George or his mom; these are things that someone looking for a reputable breeder needs to know about. | | | | |
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Addy, CGC
Let's go for a- walk! |
| | Barked: Tue Nov 13, '07 7:05am PST | | | | | | I don't agree with your statement that we lump reputable breeders in with the other not so reputable ones. We state over and over again that we are NOT talking about them. I will say, for every litter born from ANY breeder is adding to the problem. Every pup that finds a home with a dog from a reputable breeder / BYB/ PM/ Hobby breeder is possibly taking a home from a rescue / shelter dog.
Daisy, this presumes that dogs--all dogs--are interchangeable. They're not. Many people will find the dog they want in a shelter, but many will not. In my area--very broadly defined, the whole northeast, small dogs in shelters are pretty rare, and snapped up quickly. If I wanted a Lab or Lab mix, or Pit or Pit mix, I could drive over to the shelter not five minutes away from me, and probably find the right dog today. Or I could call the very nice people at Animal Control in my city, tell them I was looking for that type of dog, and probably get first crack at a nice stray before he ever went to the shelter.
But the fact is, I can't handle that type of dog. I'm an older, tiny, woman with a tiny house and no yard, a bad knee, and no ability to give that type of dog the kind of physical activity it needs, and, not a trivial point for me, no ability to pick up a dog of that size and carry it to the car to get it to the vet, if it were too sick or injured to walk to the car. There is NO dog sitting in a shelter because I called around to reputable breeders looking for an available dog who did meet my needs. If you think otherwise, you are deluding yourself.
And when you say there is, when you say that every dog bought from a breeder takes a home from a shelter dog, you are lumping the good breeders with the bad, as equally "the problem."
Honestly For me I have more respect from reputable breeders who either sponsor or adopt a shelter dog every time they produce a litter.
That would be one or two dogs a year--at the very most. (Sorry, George, but that's the truth.) Not a huge dent in the problem. They make a much bigger difference by carefully screening potential puppy buyers, providing advice and assistance to those who do buy their puppies and dogs, by having and enforcing spay/neuter clauses in their contracts, and taking back a puppy or dog at ANY TIME if the buyer cannot keep it for ANY reason. Responsibly bred dogs don't wind up in shelters (or if they do, and the breeder finds out about it, they get pulled, very quickly), and they don't become the foundation dogs for BYBs and puppy millers. If every new pet dog came from a responsible breeder, the shelter population would plummet. | | | | |
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George- Sullivan- Bailey, SDIT
Proud to be a- Connemara- terrier! |
| | Barked: Tue Nov 13, '07 9:12am PST | | | | | | Oye.
She does not have black-and-tan hunt terriers for sale... she was helping to mentor another breeder, Aisling Bray Terriers, to begin a breeding program. No, hunt terriers are NOT "black and tan Jack Russells" - they are a different strain of terrier altogether. Since I do not know much (if anything) about the hunt terriers, I'll refrain from speaking more about them lest I open myself up to attack.
Bijou, since they are still a "young" program I agree with what you're saying about not being able to pick up on certain genetic traits that may or may not be present in the lines. However, if you do have further concerns or questions about her breeding program, I would strongly encourage you to give her a ring and speak with her about it. She could tell you much more about these terriers and her breeding program than I ever could, for sure! And, like I said before, she LOVES talking about her dogs and the breeding program, and she's also very interested in learning. I'm sure she could benefit from the advice of a breeder like yourself, who's been breeding a lot longer than she. 
Addy, I understand that no one's trying to deliberately attack or belittle. On an intellectual level, I get that. But this breeder has taught me SO much about responsible dog ownership and what to look for in an excellent, reputable breeder... has provided excellent advice and always been there for me ever since I first decided to reserve Sully (months before his parents were bred, btw)... and has become a close personal friend. So, on an emotional level, this kind of stuff does sting a bit. But, like I said, I firmly believe "to each his own," and no breeding program is above scrutiny and questioning. It's in the questions that we all grow and learn. So, no hard feelings towards anyone here.
With that being said, thanks Pugsley... your words were a salve for me 
Bowing out, hoping I haven't offended anyone too much...
~ Sully and Sarah (Mommy) | | | | |
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bijou
simply the best |
| | Barked: Tue Nov 13, '07 9:13am PST | | | | | | Pugsley - all I am trying to do is point out less than ethical breeding practices - take another look at their site - do your REALLY feel comfortable with their claims and their practices ?.
I have never claimed to be the best breeder - but I certainly try as hard as I can to breed responsibly and I do have lots of experience to draw on....those with less may well be taken in by glib sounding phrases and promises !. | | | | |
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