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Raw Food Diet > Brand New to Raw
Ginger

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Barked: Mon Jan 26, '15 5:54pm PST 
If she is a bit 'fluffy' then feed her 2% of her ideal weight. You can bump it up a bit later if she really needs it. 2% of 63 pounds is 20 ounces. In a couple months her diet might be 2 ounces of bone a day, 1 ounce of liver, 1 ounce of kidney and the rest is meat/tripe/egg/fish. The bone will be inside some meat!

For right now give her 20 ounces of chicken with the bone inside each day. Of all the bones in chicken the easiest for my dogs have been the ribs and backbone. The legs are hardest to digest, they can chomp them up just fine. The neck is absolutely off limits for a good sized dog, they would likely be swallowed whole! I'd find a good deal on whole chicken, buy several 5 pound birds, cut into quarters and freeze the leg quarters and various innards for later. Cut the breast/wing quarter roughly into half and she gets one piece morning and night. Don't worry if she isn't getting 19.75-20.25 ounces a day, she will be fine with a bit less or a bit more. See if you can make the bits as wide as possible so she must chomp them more rather than swallow that delicious stuff you obviously gave her by mistake and she better get it down quick before you realize your mistake!

Have you seen Chance's raw feeding primer? While she is nomming up the chicken this week read up on how and what to be looking for and what and how to do next. Look for and remove any spaces dogster has put in the address!

http://www.chanceslittlewebsite.com/prey-model-raw.html

I did a bazillion calculations before Max really started raw. I could only store a month's worth of food in the freezer so multiplied it all out and figured how much bone was in the bony stuff and all that. That information is in the link. Some days he got more bone, some days a little less. In the end I worked out that a bony bit plus organ for 2 days one day followed by plain meat/egg/fish the next meant he had nicer bony meats to eat and his stool remained firm. Ginger was able to do that inside 3 months and she often gets bone only every 3 days now!
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» There has since been 0 posts. Last posting by Ginger, Mon 5:54 pm

Raw Food Diet > Dog pooping too much
Ginger

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Barked: Mon Jan 26, '15 4:19pm PST 
Usually is your experience in the past. New dog, new data.

Ginger is 14 pounds and her raw fed poop is huge, easily the size of 35 pound Max's who ate 250% what she gets. Trick is she poops only a couple times a WEEK. Max pooped once per meal and a meal according to his gut could be 1 ounce. Sassy pooped once a day and the size varied depending on how much she had gotten into the previous day. So after learning Ginger's strange pattern I am going to just go with keep the stool dark and not hard and not be concerned with frequency!

My off the wall guess is your Doberman's gut is getting rid of that hard uncomfortable stuff quickly. Is he active and moving most of the time? Could that be part of it?
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» There has since been 0 posts. Last posting by Ginger, Mon 4:19 pm


Raw Food Diet > New to raw feeding & have some questions

Ginger

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Barked: Mon Jan 26, '15 8:22am PST 
Eat all the chicken bone but doesn't have to eat all of beef bones. Max just gnawed off the ends of ribs and probably would have been able to gnaw most of the actual knuckle of beef bones. You want about 10% bone, bone that is large enough that it gets broken up before it is swallowed and softer than the dog's teeth. The long shaft of beef leg bones are definitely off limits for actual eating, some won't allow gnawing on either. The knuckles are likely soft enough.

I haven't gone camping with dogs fed fresh food. My plan was to find a container the exact shape/size of the cooler going with me and pack daily meals in baggies. Squish those baggies carefully into the container and freeze. Be careful, any wrinkles would freeze and make it hard to get the baggies separated. I know camping at altitude a regular ice chest packed with frozen food would stay frozen for a week as overnight temperatures dropped close to freezing and we had to thaw out meals in the pot even in the middle of the week.

Or make pemmican. Trim fat and skin of meat used, take out bone completely. Make plain jerky of the meat and organs you are planning to use. Render the fat and skin and mix fat with the jerky. Chop and add the skin as well I suppose. I'd get bone meal and add 900mg of calcium per pound of raw organ, meat and fat. Probably make into patties and freeze anyway. Haven't done this, sure seems like a fun project.

Trick is how much to feed. I'd weigh all that went in, remembering to subtract the bone weight to figure it out. Likely be 16 ounces down to about 8-10. Now you know the amount that is equivalent you need to take double the usual as dogs use a lot more energy camping then at home. Kibble fed Sassy got 1.5x the usual plus dish/pot washing duty and came home scrawny after a 6 mile 3 day backpacking trip for example. There was a 6 year old boy on that trip and there was lots of cleaning up after him and she still was a scarecrow!

Or, get one of the low carb dried foods like Ziwi Peak or Real Meat. Be very sure to try it out at home first. Max didn't do well with Real Meat chunks for some reason, Ziwi Peak jerky worked better.
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» There has since been 0 posts. Last posting by Ginger, Mon 8:22 am


Raw Food Diet > Dog pooping too much

Ginger

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Barked: Sun Jan 25, '15 9:37pm PST 
If it is crumbly and yellow to white that is a lot more than a little too much bone! I'd be cutting the bone content he is getting in half over the next week if he is on a balanced raw diet or moving to adding organ or other proteins if he is still on plain chicken. If you are taking off the skin then start leaving more and more of it on if he tolerates fat.

Hard poop isn't comfortable for him, less bone tomorrow!
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» There has since been 3 posts. Last posting by Ginger, Mon 4:19 pm


Raw Food Diet > New to raw feeding & have some questions

Ginger

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Barked: Sun Jan 18, '15 8:12am PST 
Feed him 3x a day. Divide the amount he will likely get as an adult dog into 3. If he is expected to be 60 pounds then he might need somewhere between 19 and 28 ounces as an adult dog. So a chicken breast that weighs 1 1/4-1 3/4 pounds a day cut into 3 pieces is about right. Just like feeding any other diet this is a rough estimate! If he gets skinny then more food, if his squishy skin gets a little thick then feed less. Remember it is better to raise a slim pup than a chunky one, you want to see some rib on him.

Sounds like too much bone is a problem? Then chicken breast is better as it is 20% bone where thighs are more like 30%. Was part of the back on the thigh? That would make it even more bone. Could be taking the back off would make the thigh perfect for him.
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» There has since been 2 posts. Last posting by Ginger, Mon 8:22 am

Raw Food Diet > Protein Rotation
Ginger

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Barked: Sat Jan 17, '15 9:54pm PST 
Most of us need to feed some bone and some organ every couple days but as for going through a variety of proteins it varies. At first I was feeding Max the same thing for a month straight as I only had a shelf in the refrigerator. He was fine.

In the past a couple dogsters have found that in lean times when only chicken could be fed dogs lost condition very quickly. They got stinky and greasy again. So try to keep at least one red meat in the month's menu. Another dogster gave up raw when 'other organ' was impossible to find and the dogs again lost condition. So try to keep that little bit of organ in the diet as well.
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» There has since been 3 posts. Last posting by Abby, Sun 6:48 pm


Raw Food Diet > New to raw feeding & have some questions

Ginger

Ready Set GO!
 
 
Barked: Sat Jan 17, '15 9:46pm PST 
Max started raw at age 8 years and had trouble with chicken thigh and drumsticks bones for a while. Oddly having trouble pooping was caused by not quite enough bone. I think the low bulk of a raw diet is hard on the gut at first and more bone helps. It is a fine line, be careful! Ginger had a couple of fossil poops when I messed up and gave her too much bone at first.

I'd try your eager guy on backs and chicken breast with ribs and back if he is having trouble with thigh bones. They are smaller and softer and harder to eat so he might respect them more. If his poop is yellow to white and hard then give him more meat with backs but the 20% bone in chicken breast could be about right.
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» There has since been 4 posts. Last posting by Ginger, Mon 8:22 am


Raw Food Diet > What did your dog(s) have to eat today?

Ginger

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Barked: Fri Jan 16, '15 7:37am PST 
Yesterday morning Ginger got some pork chunks.
For dinner last night she got a chunk of chicken back.
For breakfast she got organ grind, fish oil and a vitamin E cap.
For dinner she is getting pork chunks.

She would like you to know she got something super terrific before the pork came out of the freezer. A fetal calf leg! It was about a pound and only lasted for 2 days with organ/tripe offered for the other meal of the day. I forgot about it, there are a number of big pieces of a 20 pound calf in the freezer to offer up.
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» There has since been 1 post. Last posting by Ember FDX, Jan 16 9:37 am


Raw Food Diet > Not sure where I fit in, want to start raw, but...

Ginger

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Barked: Fri Jan 16, '15 7:31am PST 
Whole prey grind is the whole animal put into the grinder, intestines/hair/blood and all. If that is what you are buying it is labeled as such. Whole prey MODEL grind is bone/meat/variety of clean organs. Even that would probably have some taurine loss as apparently oxygen depletes taurine and of course grinding exposes more surface to air.

It is extremely easy to do a good elimination diet with raw and I would go ahead and do that. Unless you do beef or the grind has some added minerals and vitamins it isn't going to be a diet to keep up for the long haul though.

It is possible there is something just wrong about processed foods for your dog. Sassy had minor and annoying anal sac blockages on chicken and rice kibble that stopped once she was on home cooked chicken and rice. I don't know what it was, perhaps the allowed amount of mold and bug toxins was just a bit more than she could handle. Perhaps the allowed amount in human grade rice is low enough that she wasn't bothered. There always is a limit and toxins and other adulterants will always be present to some degree! I don't know but I do suspect it was toxins rather than the actual ingredients that were the problem.
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» There has since been 2 posts. Last posting by Pepper,Little Duke, KoaKoa, Mon 9:54 am

Raw Food Diet > Not sure where I fit in, want to start raw, but...
Ginger

Ready Set GO!
 
 
Barked: Thu Jan 15, '15 8:42pm PST 
If your dog is really miserable then consider that nasty sounding vet diet to be medicine. It can calm things down. If you feed novel proteins when the gut is inflamed wouldn't it be easy for proteins to pass through and become another allergen?

A whole prey grind caused a cat raw feeding study to be terminated early a few years back. Since the guts were in there the added bacteria destroyed taurine before the cat could use it and cats got sick. If your pet has compromised health I wonder if using a little powdered taurine might be a good idea if this is a whole prey grind that has guts in it? Dogs are supposed to make their own taurine from a couple of amino acids but evidence is piling up that that doesn't always happen. Some dogs get heart disease or seizures that can be corrected if taurine is supplemented.
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» There has since been 4 posts. Last posting by Pepper,Little Duke, KoaKoa, Mon 9:54 am

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