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How do I train my dog to do that? » Group Forum

Waking backwards

  
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ARCHMX Asher- RL1X RL2X- RL3X RL

we will dance in- the ring without- words		 
 
Barked: Mon Apr 14, '08 5:53am PST 
OK, I got some ideas on the advocates forum, but am always looking for more.

How do I teach Asher to walk backwards?

Remember that touching him is a no no for several reasons. I like hands off training and touching Asher when he is in the zone and uberfocused is not healthy.
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Gio

CD RE (CKC)- RXMCL (CARO) FM- CGN SJATD
 
 
Barked: Tue Apr 15, '08 4:22pm PST 
Are you looking for a walk backwards while he is in heel position, or walk backwards away from you?

Here is how I trained both.

Walk backwards while in heel position:
- I started against a long flat wall (down a hallway is great!) with just enough room between my left side and the wall for the dog to comfortably fit. Heel forwards a few times so that the dog gets used to walking in close proximity to the wall. Then start at the end of the hallway, walk forwards about half way, then take one step backwards in a smooth transition between forward walking and backwards walking. If the dog makes any effort to stay in heel position or makes any movement backwards, click and treat. Repeat.

I apply a hand signal and command once the general gist of the movement is understood. I know many people do not apply a command until the whole movement is cemented, but I have found success in other ways. When you want to add a command/signal is totally up to you. The signal I use is an open hand held at waist level, palm facing down over the dog's head, and the word "back".

I keep practicing walking backwards while against the wall, adding more steps, or requiring straighter "backs", and altering your clicks accordingly. Once you can do about 3-4 straight steps backwards along the wall, move out away from the wall 6-12 inches and continue. I have found that it is easier to get a fluid backwards movement if you begin by walking forward a few steps and abruptly walking backwards. And as always, start small with only one step at a time before expecting more.

Walk backwards away from you:
Have the dog standing in front of you, facing you. Hold a treat in your hand and "pretend" as if you are going to toss it so that it lands just on the back of your dog's neck. If they backup to "catch" the treat, click and then toss the treat. Do not call the dog forward to get the treat, always toss the treat so that the dog is moving away from you to get it. This reinforces that they need to move away from you, even if they start out by turning around to move away. This also works really well if your dog is toy or ball motivated ... do the same action, acting as if you are going to toss the toy so that it lands just barely behind the dog's head. When they back up to adjust to catch it, click and toss for real.
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ARCHMX Asher- RL1X RL2X- RL3X RL

we will dance in- the ring without- words		 
 
Barked: Thu Apr 17, '08 4:55pm PST 
Thanks, Gio. Although the idea of sticking my hand in Asher's face when he is trying to figure out what he needs to do is a little frightening!!!

I'm working on it!!
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Gio

CD RE (CKC)- RXMCL (CARO) FM- CGN SJATD
 
 
Barked: Fri Apr 18, '08 9:38am PST 
Were you meaning the hand signal that I use for back in heel position? Sorry, maybe I didn't explain it well. The hand is not in the dog's face. It's above their head, palm facing down towards the floor, hand held at waist level. So for my guys, it is about a foot and a half above Gio's head, or 2 feet above Romeo's. So when they are looking up at me in heel position (I like a loose wrap during heel with eye contact the majority of the time) the hand is in their line of sight.

In normal forward heel for Gio, I normally have my arm at my side, bent at the elbow, hand in a loose fist. If it is down by my side I bump him in the head. For Romeo in a forward heel, my arm is straight down by my side. So changing the hand from a loose fist to a flat hand (for Gio) and raising the arm slightly at my side and giving a flat palm (for Romeo), it reminds them to stay straight in heel position as we are backing up. I found that without the visual reminder, they tend to focus too much on speed (damn Shelties) and end up veering off behind me instead of staying straight.

If that isn't an issue for Asher, then you could just forego the hand signal and ask for him to stay in heel position as you are backing up. Maybe a verbal reminder for "heel", and then you should be able to change your position however you want and he can adjust accordingly. Then just some practice to smooth things over. big grin
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ARCHMX Asher- RL1X RL2X- RL3X RL

we will dance in- the ring without- words		 
 
Barked: Sat Apr 19, '08 6:11pm PST 
Thanks, Gio, you da bomb!!!
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ARCHMX Asher- RL1X RL2X- RL3X RL

we will dance in- the ring without- words		 
 
Barked: Wed Apr 30, '08 5:20am PST 
OK, Ali gave me a great, hands off way to teach Ash to walk backwards. I sit in a kitchen chair, with my feet in front of the legs. I throw a treat under the chair. Of course, Ash goes under to get it. When he finishes, how will he get out from under the chair? He has to walk backwards!!!! C/T and repeat.

Naturally, it is not as simple as that. I will have to move the backing up from under the chair to other places, but I can do that.

My trainer is a freakin' genuis. I would have NEVER, EVER, EVER thought of that.
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Summer

Have a Nice Day!		 
 
Barked: Wed Apr 30, '08 12:40pm PST 
Ash, that IS pretty freakin' genius!!! I've been told to use the long hallway approach like Gio posted, but haven't tried it. I actually use the narrow space between my sink/stove and my kitchen island/chest freezer. It's about a 6 ft long, three ft wide space where I get Summer to stand facing me, then encourage her to follow me, and then I slowly walk into her and feed her continuously as she backs up. I only tried it a couple of times, but your post is making me want to revisit it soon!
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ARCHMX Asher- RL1X RL2X- RL3X RL

we will dance in- the ring without- words		 
 
Barked: Wed Apr 30, '08 2:12pm PST 
Ash seems to have what Ali calls "space issues" and when I try to back him up, he sits and just lets me walk into him.

I really have issues thinking outside of the box and she seems to do it so naturally. Of course, she just tells me that good trainers are not afraid to steal other trainers methods laugh out loud
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Summer

Have a Nice Day!		 
 
Barked: Wed Apr 30, '08 5:39pm PST 
Ha actually Summer does the SAME THING - she'll naturally sit, especially since this is how we taught her Sit from a Down - I just moved my body into her "space" and she sits. It's how we taught it from a distance too - I would thrust my hips forward to get her to sit. So she kept trying to sit in the narrow space, and I kept saying, "Noooo that's not it, try again", made her stand, and then she took one tiny step back and it was, "YESSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" *treat treat treat treat treat*

She musta thought it was christmas or something. laugh out loud
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Romeo

CD RE (CKC) CRS- RV (CARO) FDX- SJATD HIC
 
 
Barked: Thu May 1, '08 8:14am PST 
Okay, I've run into a problem with this and Romeo, so have tried to figure out another way of training it.

Last Friday at my obedience drop in time, I was working Romeo with the backup three steps station for Rally-O. I don't know if it is included in AKC or APDT Rally, it isn't in CKC, but it is in CARO. Anyways, the dog has to remainin heel position as the handler takes three steps backwards. So essentially the dog is heeling backwards for the distance of three human steps. I had been doing a combination of the wall and the marionette techniques and it was working pretty good. But at one point I had move out away from the way and asked Romeo to backup with me, he ended up speeding backwards (damn Sheltie) and veered behind me and I stumbled and crunched his toes. Of course, he is a pretty big drama queen, so let out a blood curdling scream. I did crunch him pretty good, but it wasn't THAT bad. Anyways, now whenever I ask him to do the backup in heel position, he leaps into the air, backwards diagonally away from me. It's actually pretty impressive the height and distance he can get in one backwards leap ... but totally not what I am looking for! haha

So anyways, I thought I would give it a rest for a while to let him forget about the toe crunch experience. Last night was the first time I tried it again since last Friday. The first try wasn't too bad, but the more we practiced, the more he seemed to "remember" the backwards leap thing.

I tried a new way, basically asking him to "get in" to heel position as I take teeny steps in any direction. So I would step forward with a little step, and ask him to "get in", treat. Take a little step to the right, ask for a "get in", treat. A little step diagonally backwards to the right, "get in", treat. Then randomly throw in a little step straight backwards, asking for a "get in" as I am moving. That actually worked the best for him, and after about 5 minutes of the random "get in" movements, I was able to get three consecutive steps backwards from him. I have to cue him to "get in" each step backwards, and it is a little jerky, but definitely some progress!

The really silly thing is that I KNOW he can backup straight for a really long distance. The routine in my house is that I won't throw a ball or toy if the dogs are crowding me, so they need to back up at least 2-3 feet from me before I will throw it. This was the very first thing that Romeo caught on to when I brought him home. And now if I am taking too long to throw a toy, he will continue to back up. The most I have seen him do is about 50ft straight backwards in one steady motion ... the only thing that stopped him is when he ran into a wall, so then he sat and continued to go through his "puppy push-ups" routine until I was able to stop laughing long enough to throw the toy. laugh out loud
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