Nolte (Retired Guide Dog)
Guide dog work- is a joyous- thing! | 
 | | Barked: Tue Mar 6, '12 6:48pm PST |  | |  | | Well, I'm baaaack. LOL. Can't stay away from this one, though I keep telling myself what Happy wrote... need to just agree to disagree.
Corrections are very, very rarely “needed,"
Not true. Already addressed this misconstrued notion.
and if they are, it is the owner/trainer/handler’s fault,
Not true. Already addressed this misconstrued notion.
and almost definitely a knee jerk reaction from being frustrated due to not knowing how to handle the situation without resorting to intimidation and fear.
Without knowing you or your experience with training, all of the above tells me you have no personal experience with guide dogs.
I wish I had a way of posting some of the old videos I have of me working my past guides... you would see them getting an occasional leash pop (and for good reason) and see that the dogs are neither itimidated or fearful during or after a correction. All it does (mostly by the noise of the tags, NOT by "choking" or "pain" as so many people tend to believe... not you Mario, people in general, I've found) is give the dog a quick reminder it made a mistake and needs to straighten up and fly right.
I do not agree that SDs need to be accountable for their handler’s life.
Absolutely every single time I step off a curb to cross a six lane highway with my guide dog, my life is in that dog's paws, and if the dog makes a mistake you better believe it needs to be held accountable... if it messes up, it gets corrected. No time to stop in the middle of the highway and do a time out (to give it time to stop distracting on some stray dog on the other side of the highway or some idiot whistling and making kissy noises out their car window) or click and treat the dog when it does make the right move in the middle of a street after becoming distracted by "whatever"! Good gosh, are you freakin' kidding me? LOL.
Many trainers use it, and they know how to use it properly, mainly as MANAGEMENT.
I could use that exact statement in relation to leash correction. 
“Um….. Okay, you’re the boss, but I’m not really sure why you did that..”
Believe me, when I give my dog a correction it darn well knows why. It's evident in how the dog immediately refocuses (in the case of distraction or sniffing) or does the correct action (if the mistake is re-worked).
IMO guide trainers should just make the d””” switch to NOT using an aversive such as leash a correction, because it CONFUSES AND/OR STRESSES the dog.
That's your opinion, you're entitled to it - but it again clearly shows you have zero understanding of guide dogs and how leash corrections work with them, or you're simply bent on believing any correction "confuses and/or stresses" (which is not true).
and maybe why so many people complain about program trained dogs having such unpredictable and even aggressive/reactive behavior (especially toward other dogs).
The only people I've ever seen complain are owner-trainers on boards like this. I've personally never known a program dog to be unpredictable or aggressive/reactive... have heard of a few, but doubtful it has anything to do with the dog having been trained with and the handler using leash correction. Quite the contrary... it's most likely due to the handler being far too lax with correctiing the dog when it DOES behave badly, so dog thinks it can get away with it.
A positive punisher (like a leash pop) can be a precise tool of communication just like a reward marker. It's all about knowing how to do it correctly.
Aaahh... Lisa, thank you!!!
Nova, I'll be interested to see how your girl acts around dogs on your next walk, too. |  |  | |  |
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