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Is feeding ground raw worth it?

This is a dedicated place for all of your questions and answers about Raw Diets. There are also some really cool groups like "Raw Fed" on the topic you can join. This forum is for people who already know they like the raw diet or sincerely want to learn more. Please remember that you are receiving advice from peers and not professionals. If you have specific health-related questions about your dog's diet, please contact your vet!

  
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Kloppers

1229827
 
 
Barked: Wed Jan 9, '13 5:14am PST 
I had posted in Homecooking Forum and Maxwell was kind enough to help me out, then my vet suggested raw being the best way to continue. She is not as educated about raw as homecooking but she is working with me to learn more.

My main question is everything I read says it is basically not worth it to feed ground raw( this is with bone, no organs) due to the fact it does nothing for the teeth. I have found a good source of meat but it is ground. Bella can not eat Chicken, beef, Lamb, or Turkey. I am hoping once I get her back on track we can try some of those in raw form. Our butcher has venison, rabbit, duck, and quail (from Blue Ridge Beef) that is all ground with bone. I can not afford venison not ground at 5/lb, I can get 30lb ground for 48 dollars. Bella would most likely be on ground always, unless she can eat raw chicken, beef, and lamb.

I have 4 dogs and 2 cats total that I would like to get on raw. I plan on getting all but Bella on a true Prey-model diet once I have the hang of it. So many sites suggest all these supplements that the dogs need ( and especially the cats) that alone will break the bank. If feeding the ground raw what supplements would they really need? The dogs currently take fish oil and Vit e, and Bella takes gluc/chron and Vit c when she has bad times.

Bella also has some gum issues that prevent her from chewing on anything. I have to keep all nylabones, raw hides( we don't use anymore), sticks, or anything else she might chew. I do give her frozen rags but not to tear up or swallow. Would this also prevent her from eating raw bones or are they soft enough?

One more thing...most raw feeding info suggests feeding as much red meat as possible but at the same time most websites say how affordable chicken is...so I know variety is key but is it really okay to feed large quantities if chicken with red meat mixed in, or could you buy mostly red meat but get bones in the diet through chicken?

Thanks in advance for any info, I have downloaded Chance's Beginners Guide to Prey Model Diet and have read it several times smile
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Lacey

1278851
 
 
Barked: Wed Jan 9, '13 9:27am PST 
I am fairly new to raw feeding; about to start week 6. Tonight, I am picking up ground raw with bone and organ from My Pet Carnivore to feed in the mornings. Doing this for a couple reasons, the primary one being the time it takes me to plan/shop/measure/bag everything. I work 60 hours a week and go to school. Husband is great at executing the program, but it is on me to get the program in place. This is a pretty pricey way to do raw, but when things settle down in a year I can take the time to figure out where to shop to get good prices, balance the diet, etc. The other issue is that mornings are crazy and no one can take the time to observe Lacey eat a meal with whole bones. Plan to feed chicken backs, thighs, and canned fish for evening meals. Hope this plan will work, and would like feedback from others if they foresee problems. So, my long answer to whether feeding ground raw is worth it is I hope so!
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Oliver

Gotta love me !
 
 
Barked: Wed Jan 9, '13 1:28pm PST 
I get free ground deer meat from a couple hunters, so my dogs diet consist mostly ground deer, chicken for bone and organs ( pork kidney & liver ). It may not be the best variety but with hubby laid off its all I can afford now. I figure its better then kibble. shrug
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Sausage

feed me
 
 
Barked: Wed Jan 9, '13 2:20pm PST 
I feed ground, because there's a brand of frozen, ground, raw prey model dog food sold in my country that's cheap and quality. A lot of people in my country use this brand, but I've only heard of a minority complaining about the teeth.
However, I also supplement with raw MEATY bones. I believe ripping and tearing the meat is an important part of the teeth cleaning, not just the bone. But if your dog can't do that, brush her teeth, once or twice a day. I believe they also sell some kind of powder to sprinkle over their food, to prevent buildup on the teeth.

When we were at the vet a while ago she complimented my dog's teeth and suggested I keep feeding her a premium kibble+brushing her teeth, as I had obviously been doing. Except I do neither...
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Maxwell

I'm triple- superior MAD- now!
 
 
Barked: Wed Jan 9, '13 4:11pm PST 
A really long time ago this thread really impressed me with how to properly feed raw.
http://www.dogster.com/forums/Raw_Food_Diet/thread/560018
Anyway red meat is much higher in several minerals than chicken and beef and lamb and wild meats have a better omega 3 balance as they are at least partly grass fed [higher omega 3] where pork, chicken and turkey is very likely all grain fed [higher omega 6]. Max needs more than half red meat to get his minerals in as he is fed less than 2% of his body weight daily. I suspect dogs that get 2% of their ideal adult body weight are fine on half cheap chicken and half red meat.

I know that offering meaty bones weekly helps keep teeth all polished up but another dogster [don't remember which one, sorry] suggested that feeding a super low carbohydrate diet also helps keep teeth clean as there is no sugar in the mouth for bacteria to grow in. Maybe if you don't cheat and offer pizza bones and such teeth won't need much brushing.

I wrote what Max gets in the other thread, a bit of zinc, fish oil, joint supplement and vitamin E. Without green tripe the diet would also be low in manganese and magnesium. If you feed about 1/2 a meal of fatty fish a week you don't need to offer fish oil but vitamin E is likely low.

I think your plan of putting the dogs on ground raw then trying Bella on the meats that bother her now is probably better than trying chicken to start out. Do feed light, stick to 2% of their ideal adult body weight at the very most as a maximum as the ground is likely higher in fat and lower in bone than the chicken parts usually suggested as a starting point. Since most dogs are coming from low fat, high bulk, low protein diets bony chicken with higher bone [bulk] and easily removed skin [fat] works pretty well.

You didn't mention pork. Pork is the cheapest red meat around here. All the bones are edible and it is easy to find nice big bits that might satisfy your eager eaters. It can be fatty but on shoulders and legs it is easy to cut away excessive fat. If Bella can tolerate pork then that could be her organ source for now. A whole pork fresh ham [raw, unsalted rear leg] or shoulder is about 6 pounds and if you pounce on a good sale at an ethnic market can be bought for about $1.50 a pound or less.
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Shiver Me- Timbers- "Charlie"

My Little Dog, a- heartbeat at my- feet.<3
 
 
Barked: Wed Jan 9, '13 4:28pm PST 
I feed ground when I can afford it(I always make sure it has bones AND organs), and supplement with raw meaty bones, raw marrow bones, knuckle bones, rib bones, etc that the dogs can gnaw on too. In fact, my work just got in a HUGE order of Bison rib bones and we're selling BIG bags of them for only $12. I intend to snatch a bag.

And Charlie won't eat poultry. Chicken, turkey, none of it, while I like to provide variety, most of his consists of white meat. Beef, pork, bison, rabbit, lamb. I'd like to try Alpaca one of these days too cause our shop offers it ground too, bol.
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Rexy

I dig in mud- puddles!
 
 
Barked: Wed Jan 9, '13 5:22pm PST 
I'm of the belief that ANY addition of appropriate raw foods is worth it.
If ground is the easiest for you, then go for it!

I end up with a lot of ground scrap meat from a butcher and will feed that for weeks at a time, and have had absolutely no issues with Rexy's teeth as I make sure to regularly offer RMBs.

I will feed the ground meat frozen or semi-frozen (it's already cut into 1lb cubes) so that it takes more than 3 seconds to eat it.
If you feed it frozen, they DO have to do some gnawing and chewing so I believe that there is still benefit to the teeth. smile
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Kloppers

1229827
 
 
Barked: Wed Jan 9, '13 5:52pm PST 
Thank you everyone for the input, and Maxwell I had completely forgot about pork (the humans in the house do not eat it). Bella has never had it so it is worth a try.

Just a quick question...what exactly is a RMB, I know it stands for raw meaty bone...but what is that really. Are these something I buy at the grocery store? They are counted as a meal? My butcher had something called meaty bone, are they the same?
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Maxwell

I'm triple- superior MAD- now!
 
 
Barked: Wed Jan 9, '13 8:39pm PST 
Best to see Charlie's excellent thread about meaty bones.
http://www.dogster.com/forums/Raw_Food_Diet/thread/737490

Basically any bone that isn't a weight bearing bone from a heavy animal or is small and/or cut like a pork chop or steak bone counts as a meaty bone to consider feeding. Then small dogs would leave a lot of bone of some cuts and large dogs might eat the whole thing. Pork is excellent. If you buy a picnic shoulder that is the upper leg bones, cut apart at the joint and you have two large meals with an edible bone in the middle. My guy would eat the knuckle part and leave most of the bone shaft. A larger dog would eat the whole thing.
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Rexy

I dig in mud- puddles!
 
 
Barked: Wed Jan 9, '13 9:57pm PST 
I consider an RMB to be any bone-in meat that requires some chewing and gnawing. smile

Chicken legs, turkey legs, etc count.
When utility grade turkeys go on sale, I buy as many as I can fit into our freezers, thaw them out, portion them out into meal-sized pieces and re-freeze until I plan to feed them.

Pork cuts that include skin can be good for some tooth-cleaning action as well. Some grocery stores tend to carry pork hocks and I've used those as RMBs too.
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