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Got a new, young, furry love in your life? This is the place for you to ask all of your questions-big or small! Just remember that you are receiving advice from other dog owners and lovers... not professionals. If you have a major problem, always seek the advice of a vet or behaviorist! Most important is to remember to have fun with your new fur baby.
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bijou
simply the best |
 | | Barked: Tue Nov 13, '07 9:35am PST | |  | |  | | George I'm a little confused ( yep I know it may be down to my age LOL ) but this is a direct quote from the website
"In the year 2006 Sheila of Connemara Terriers , a well respected and experienced breeder of Russell Terriers, traveled through out Ireland and selected the best Hunt Terrier puppies available for our breeding program. "
This certainly reads as if the hunt terriers are owned by the breeder of the Connemara terriers - there appears to be no other owner named .
I'm really pleased that she has given you loads of follow up service and that you feel happy with her but would ask if you got a full pedigree with your pup ....or a copy of the parents hip/eye results....and if not why ? |  |  | |  |
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Rocky
Got Food? |
| | Barked: Tue Nov 13, '07 10:04am PST | | | | | | I liked a lot of what I saw on the Connemara website, but I like to reserve judgement until I meet the breeder and see her with her dogs. I like breeders who breed less frequently, but, depending on their working circumstance, extended family support and help, I know some can handle more than others.
I originally waited on a list for a Cavalier breeder who had a great website and represented herself well at the shows, but when I actually visited, I really did not like how she treated and handled her dogs, so I took my name off the list.
One of the things that actually did bother me about this JRT breeder is that George mentioned she is working tirelessly to get this strain formally recognized by the AKC.
The pursuit of AKC status was the reason for the Jack Russell and Parson Russell Terrier split in the first place, with the JRT breeders firmly not wanting to go with the AKC. I probably would really like this breeder, but have an opposite take on dog politics than she does, and I would be fighting AKC status.
This is an interesting link on that topic:
The AKC embraces the Jack Russell
Most often, as soon as the conformation show ring gets involved with a working breed, the emphasis becomes on breeding with less variability, and the broad genetic base is narrowed. I firmly believe working breeds thrive far better away from the showdog system.
This is a quote about Collie's, but I love it.
"Big one, little one, handsome one, ugly ones, long-coated, short-coated: nobody gave a damn. How's his outrun? Can he read sheep? Can he move a rank old cow?" - Don McCaig, Dog Wars
Obviously, for me, having a breeder who competes in conformation shows is not a high priority. They can prove their reputability in many other ways. | | | | |
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Gray Dawn- Treader
Don't Tread on- me
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 | | Barked: Tue Nov 13, '07 6:54pm PST | | | | | | Daisy, you had a lot of good points. I disagree on that all breeders are the problem (and not because I want to be a reputable breeder) though. When I said a breeder should support rescue and breeders, I meant ideally. I would still buy from a breeder who didn't support rescue, as long as he did the absolute requirements. You shouldn't buy from a BYB, but I'd much rather buy from a BYB than a puppy mill. | | | | |
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Daisy DLCC
We are foster- failures now.
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| | Barked: Wed Nov 14, '07 3:24am PST | | | | | | This is what I said.
"I will say, for every litter born from ANY breeder is adding to the problem. Every pup that finds a home with a dog from a reputable breeder / BYB/ PM/ Hobby breeder is possibly taking a home from a rescue / shelter dog."
Any dog that is produced is adding more to the population. That means from any breeder of any type.
Addy..."Daisy, this presumes that dogs--all dogs--are interchangeable. They're not. Many people will find the dog they want in a shelter, but many will not. In my area--very broadly defined, the whole northeast, small dogs in shelters are pretty rare, and snapped up quickly. If I wanted a Lab or Lab mix, or Pit or Pit mix, I could drive over to the shelter not five minutes away from me, and probably find the right dog today. Or I could call the very nice people at Animal Control in my city, tell them I was looking for that type of dog, and probably get first crack at a nice stray before he ever went to the shelter. "
Nowhere did I say dogs are interchangeable. I stand by my statement that IF you don't find a dog in a shelter/ rescue etc. then by all means get a REPUTABLE breeder dog. I also still stand by my statement that there is always a way to support shelter / rescue dogs even if you are a breeder by adopting or sponsoring a shelter dog. Heck to sponsor a dog costs about $20 per month. Some places even less. I never once said YOU HAVE TO get a shelter dog.
I also said people have got to read what is really said and not just pick things and turn it around to suit what you think is said ( anyone ).
"That would be one or two dogs a year--at the very most. (Sorry, George, but that's the truth.) Not a huge dent in the problem. They make a much bigger difference by carefully screening potential puppy buyers, providing advice and assistance to those who do buy their puppies and dogs, by having and enforcing spay/neuter clauses in their contracts, and taking back a puppy or dog at ANY TIME if the buyer cannot keep it for ANY reason. Responsibly bred dogs don't wind up in shelters (or if they do, and the breeder finds out about it, they get pulled, very quickly), and they don't become the foundation dogs for BYBs and puppy millers. If every new pet dog came from a responsible breeder, the shelter population would plummet. "
I work with shelters / rescue etc. I can tell you that almost half is a "reputable" breeder dog in shelters. Most don't find out about it because most don't check or they are in a different area then the dog. Just because you THINK shelter dogs are not from reputable breeders don't make it so. All you have to do is go see / ask a shelter / foster worker.
There is no dog that is right for everyone just like there is no person right for every dog. Having been a breeder ( years ago )and now do rescue / shelter / adoption ( for over 30 yrs along with breeding ) I do know you can do both. When I did breed, if my dog had ( example ) 5 pups, I would pay for 5 pups in a shelter ( if I couldn't adopt at least one ). I would always adopt the " unadoptable" or sponsor them. When I said about everytime a breeder breeds to adopt or sponsor, I am saying it should be for EVERY pup produced. Not just that breeding.
People have to read what is truely said  Edited by author Wed Nov 14, '07 3:25am PST
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Addy, CGC
Let's go for a- walk! |
| | Barked: Wed Nov 14, '07 5:45am PST | | | | | | I work with shelters / rescue etc. I can tell you that almost half is a "reputable" breeder dog in shelters. Most don't find out about it because most don't check or they are in a different area then the dog. Just because you THINK shelter dogs are not from reputable breeders don't make it so. All you have to do is go see / ask a shelter / foster worker.
Ah, but they found out when you picked up the phone and called them, right? No? What's that? You didn't call them? Why not? Because you had no clue to the identity of this "reputable breeder" ? So you know the dog came from a "reputable breeder" how exactly? Because the person surrendering the dog said so?
Remember, Daisy, you said these dogs weren't pulled by their "reputable breeders" because the breeders never found out they were in shelters. That means either you knew who the breeders were and didn't bother to contact them, or you didn't know who the breeders were, and so have no clue whether or not they were "reputable" and "responsible" and would have pulled the dogs if they had found out.
Reputable breeders stay in contact with their puppy buyers. They know where their puppies go, with a very low failure rate. No, the failure rate is not zero, but no, reputable breeders are not the problem.
ETA: Highest number I've heard for purebred dogs in shelters is 25% and even that seems to be straining the definition somewhat. If only 25% of dogs in shelters are purebred, how can 50% of dogs in shelters be from "reputable breeders"? Unless you're lumping puppy millers and BYBs who are producing "designer dogs" into the "reputable breeder" category because they all say they're "reputable" ?
There is no dog that is right for everyone just like there is no person right for every dog. Having been a breeder ( years ago )and now do rescue / shelter / adoption ( for over 30 yrs along with breeding ) I do know you can do both. When I did breed, if my dog had ( example ) 5 pups, I would pay for 5 pups in a shelter ( if I couldn't adopt at least one ). I would always adopt the " unadoptable" or sponsor them. When I said about everytime a breeder breeds to adopt or sponsor, I am saying it should be for EVERY pup produced. Not just that breeding.
So, you want to take what's already a barely-break-even labor of love, and say that the people doing it are bad people if they don't participate in shelter/rescue/adoption work in particular ways that satisfy you, with all those profits they don't have.
It might, in fact, be those many, many months when the breeders don't have puppies underfoot that they'd better able to sponsor, or foster--which I notice you don't mention, but which I know many breeders do, or contribute their time or labor to the local shelter. Or they might provide organizational support, or do home-checks on potential adopters or fosterers in their area. Or any number of useful things, other than "adopt or sponsor a dog for every puppy born."
Oh, and on the "adding to the population"--have you read Redemption by Nathan Winograd yet? You might get a shock.Edited by author Wed Nov 14, '07 5:50am PST
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Daisy DLCC
We are foster- failures now.
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| | Barked: Wed Nov 14, '07 5:59am PST | | | | | | Ok Addy, you want to argue.. no problem.
"Ah, but they found out when you picked up the phone and called them, right? No? What's that? You didn't call them? Why not? Because you had no clue to the identity of this "reputable breeder" ? So you know the dog came from a "reputable breeder" how exactly? Because the person surrendering the dog said so? "
The ones we know that came from Reputable Breeders, give the papers. We DO NOT take the word of the owner that they are purebred from a breeder. Most are from other provinces / states. Legally it is NOT the shelter / rescue reponsiblity to contact the breeder. As we are NOT under contract with them to notify. Most times we do and in some cases they don't have the funds / time / space etc. to take these dogs back.
" Highest number I've heard for purebred dogs in shelters is 25% and even that seems to be straining the definition somewhat. If only 25% of dogs in shelters are purebred, how can 50% of dogs in shelters be from "reputable breeders"? Unless you're lumping puppy millers and BYBs who are producing "designer dogs" into the "reputable breeder" category because they all say they're "reputable" ? "
I never once said THEY ARE the problem. I said they are part of the problem . So please read EXACTLY AND UNDERSTAND WHAT I said.
"So, you want to take what's already a barely-break-even labor of love, and say that the people doing it are bad people if they don't participate in shelter/rescue/adoption work in particular ways that satisfy you, with all those profits they don't have. "
I NEVER once said they are bad. I never once said they had to SATISFY me. I said it would be good if they did adopt / sponsor but I would not judge them badly because they didn't. Again please read.
"Oh, and on the "adding to the population"--have you read Redemption by Nathan Winograd yet? You might get a shock."
I have read it and seems to me have understood it better. | | | | |
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Pugsley
I Might Be Small- But I Have It- All!
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| | Barked: Wed Nov 14, '07 6:11am PST | | | | | | Hey Daisy 
I am not trying to fight nor argue with you, as I know what you are saying..
I was just wondering when you say "The ones we know that came from Reputable Breeders, give the papers."
Are you saying that because they have papers they came from a reputable breeder? Because Buddy has papers and came from a puppymill... Just because they have papers doesn't mean they came from a reputable breeder. Just wondering what you meant by that  | | | | |
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Pugsley
I Might Be Small- But I Have It- All!
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| | Barked: Wed Nov 14, '07 6:11am PST | | | [notify] |
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Pugsley
I Might Be Small- But I Have It- All!
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| | Barked: Wed Nov 14, '07 6:12am PST | | | [notify] |
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