pitbulls are not bad dogs

If you are wondering what is the right dog for you, this is the place to be. In this introductory forum we talk about topics such as breed vs. mix, size, age, grooming, breeders, shelters, rescues as well as requirements for exercise, space and care. No question is too silly here. This particular forum is for getting and giving helpful, nice advice. It is definitely not a forum for criticizing someone else's opinion, knowledge or advice. This forum is all about tail wagging and learning.

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Keira

Mommy's Girl

Barked: Sat Mar 31, '12 3:06pm PST


	Well said, Ava!

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Milton

Im just a little- guy

Barked: Sat Mar 31, '12 4:02pm PST


	I walk my dog on the sidewalk often. He is off leash on trails, but not on the sidewalk. If I see a pit bull I do not pull my dog in close to me. I don't pull him in for any breeds. I am more worried about behavior than breed. My dog heels with out any commands or training if we encounter another dog who is acting overly excited or aggressive. He seems to know who to avoid. Over the years he has meet pit bulls on trails and on sidewalks with out being ate or attacked. Today it was an aggressive Labrador to watch out for. I did not shorten his flexi and he heeled. The lab owner did not have it so easy. i can tell what dogs to avoid by the owner and dog behavior. I could see the lab owner tensing up and shortening the leash. I don't do the same. I just keep walking and ignore the dog. My dog heels to me when this occurs. I think some people are worried about the flexi. They probably think I will behave like a flexi user stereotype and my little dog will run right into their aggressive dog's jaws. Nope, got one of the most street smart socialized dog ever. At a recent party my dog was followed around and overly loved by an intact male pit bull. I was not worried. There were more than one pit at the party. None of them ate my dog.

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(retired)min- ister misty

be calm, dont- worry!

Barked: Sun Apr 1, '12 3:45am PST


	o no...there are dogs that are bred to work,herd or help with hunting..but my point is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! there is NO dog with the instinct to kill...or fight... we should stick with the facts and that's a fact.... do you know what breed was trained from instinct to kill? and than i talk about the roman times..... the english bulldog...(back than they were called bull killers) they were so dangerous that roman laws stated they could not be unleased in the local population and it took generations to breed the instinct out of the english bulldog.... if you say pitbull's have fight instincts...than why not take the rotties with it...cane corso's,boer boels and many large breeds... are they all born with a fighting instinct ava? how? are they bred with it? it's not something emotional...i know pitbull's and they have one huge problem..the people that buy them. they are strong,not born with a fighting instinct...but you can create them in what ever you like....and that counts all large breeds that are there to protect and serve people in it.... and i saw many members in this forum that are in this discussion that own breeds that are on the bsl list.....because that list is pretty big.... do they agree their furchild is bred as a killer,a fighter from instinct? 1. AIREDALE TERRIER 2. AKBASH 3. AKITA 4. ALAPAHA BLUE BLOOD BULLDOG 5. ALASKAN MALAMUTE 6. ALSATIAN SHEPHERD 7. AMERICAN BULLDOG 8. AMERICAN HUSKY 9. AMERICAN PIT BULL TERRIER 10. AMERICAN STAFFORDSHIRE TERRIER 11. AMERICAN WOLFDOG 12. ANATOLIAN SHEPHERD 13. ARIKARA DOG 14. AUSTRALIAN CATTLE DOG 15. AUSTRALIAN SHEPHERD 16. BELGIAN MALINOIS 17. BELGIAN SHEEPDOG 18. BELGIAN TURVUREN 19. BLUE HEELER 20. BOERBUL 21. BORZOI 22. BOSTON TERRIER 23. BOUVIER DES FLANDRES 24. BOXER 25. BULLDOG 26. BULL TERRIER 27. BULL MASTIFF 28. CANE CORSO 29. CATAHOULA LEOPARD DOG 30. CAUCASIAN SHEPHERD 31. CHINESE SHAR PEI 32. CHOW-CHOW 33. COLORADO DOG 34. DOBERMAN PINSCHER 35. DOGO DE ARGENTINO 36. DOGUE DE BORDEAUX 37. ENGLISH MASTIFFS 38. ENGLISH SPRINGER SPANIEL 39. ESKIMO DOG 40. ESTRELA MOUNTAIN DOG 41. FILA BRASILIERO 42. FOX TERRIER 43. FRENCH BULLDOG 44. GERMAN SHEPHERD DOG 45. GOLDEN RETRIEVER 46. GREENLAND HUSKY 47. GREAT DANE 48. GREAT PYRANEES 49. ITALIAN MASTIFF 50. KANGAL DOG 51. KEESHOND 52. KOMONDOR 53. KOTEZEBUE HUSKY 54. KUVAZ 55. LABRADOR RETRIEVER 56. LEONBERGER 57. MASTIFF 58. NEOPOLITAN MASTIFF 59. NEWFOUNDLAND 60. OTTERHOUND 61. PRESA DE CANARIO 62. PRESA DE MALLORQUIN 63. PUG 64. ROTTWEILER 65. SAARLOOS WOLFHOND 66. SAINT BERNARD 67. SAMOYED 68. SCOTTISH DEERHOUND 69. SIBERIAN HUSKY 70. SPANISH MASTIFF 71. STAFFORDSHIRE BULL TERRIER 72. TIMBER SHEPHERD 73. TOSA INU 74. TUNDRA SHEPHERD 75. WOLF SPITZ and take a good look at that list,this is the new list of breeds that are on the list of 2012... look and i wonder if you would giggle when you see some of the breeds in it... forget the pitbull's the list will grow and grow and grow,until your sweet doggie is on it to... every time a thread or furum is started about the pit breed,in the end they all talk about agression! why not talk about the pitbull and the dog it really is! i dare people....search the internet,talk to people that have pitbull's,look at those that own the viscious one's and look what kind of person walks behind that dog in general.... look at the shelters...look at the news when they do raids in pitbull rings and see how the pitbull's are starved and beaten to fight,because they will not do it from their INSTINCTS... the pitbull's that are used as bait dogs,because they simply don't have it in them to get viscious and are thrown in with the pit's that made it in the eyes of criminals... look with you heart..see their pain....see how they suffer and stop judging.... if more people would help instead of just say they are killers and fighters and that's it...than they will never be saved and thing will never get changed.... they are animals...they do not think,hmmmm let's kill a child,dog or let's fight to the death for fun... one day people will see... and i hope that than we will not be to late...

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(retired)min- ister misty

be calm, dont- worry!

Barked: Sun Apr 1, '12 3:47am PST


	and keira,you own a pit yourself...you agree that your keira is a dog that will kill when she gets the chance just because she's a pitbull? well have i ever wow?

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Keira

Mommy's Girl

Barked: Sun Apr 1, '12 4:32am PST


	I admit that Keira is not DA. But that is not to say she would ever be. American Pit Bull Terriers were bred from Bull-and-Terrier crosses to be DOG AGGRESSIVE so that they would succeed in the fighting ring. On the other hand, any human aggression was bred out, so that the dogs could be safely separated in the fight ring by any handler, and the handler would not risk being turned on by the dog. This is history, and fact. Any good APBT owner knows and accepts this. Keira is a wonderful dog, she is gentle, perfect with children, she even has a hamster of her own that she plays with daily, and never hurts. I have over 100 friends and acquaintances with APBT's... and a little over half of those are dog aggressive. It can be managed, and most of those with DA dogs have more than one. They just keep them separated. But yes, I fully agree that Pit Bulls have a higher rate of Dog Aggression than most other breeds. It's not because of hwo they were trained, it's simply genetic. This is not a frowned upon trait. Keira is just out of the norm for her breed by being so accepting of any new dog or animal. She has no prey drive whatsoever.

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Keira

Mommy's Girl

Barked: Sun Apr 1, '12 4:46am PST


	And while I appreciate so many stand-up advocates for the breed... "Marketing" them as "the same as any dog" is actually detrimental to the breed, as no two breeds, just as no two dogs, are exactly alike. There are always variations within the breed. But for the average pet owner, I would never suggest an APBT. These are high energy, very intense, strong dogs who could easily overwhelm a novice owner. They need firm leadership, and knowledgeable owners who will keep them safe in all ways. This breed is much vilified, and extremely misunderstood. Also, as someone stated previously: A disaster in the wrong hands. With this breed it is always extremes. If your dog is good, it's a "all how they were raised"... if it bites someone... well, you know how the media loves to run with that. As a general rule (from those more knowlegeable than I in these dogs) APBT's do not need doggy friends to have a happy life. Dog Parks are a no no, and you should always expect your dog to fight, as it id a genentic trait that can not be trained out. Some APBT's (Like Keira!) are great with other dogs.... Most would as soon kill the dog as play with it. Most shelter "Pit Bulls" are mixes anyways, and therefore the genetics are "watered down" What I refer to are purebred, can trace their lineage back at least 8 generations American Pit Bull Terriers.

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Member Since
03/19/2012

Barked: Sun Apr 1, '12 6:43am PST


	Thank you got your postings on this topic, Ava and Keira. One of the problems with an open forum is that everyone has an opinion. And most feel the need to share their opinions, no matter how ill-founded.

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Gunther

Giant Shih Tzu

Barked: Sun Apr 1, '12 7:10am PST


	"there is NO dog with the instinct to kill...or fight..." Um... what? In case you've forgotten, dogs are ANIMALS. Animals that have historically survived by scavenging and hunting other animals. I'm sorry, PLENTY of dogs have a POWERFUL instinct to kill other animals and to fight other dogs. That's just absurd you can even claim they don't. My Jack Russell terrier was trying to kill mice and rabbits when she was under a year old. My Chow was showing signs of DA when he was just a pup, and that was WITH socilization. No matter how much socilization he got, he would fight another male dog if they came onto our property, no questions asked. That is INSTINCT.

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(retired)min- ister misty

be calm, dont- worry!

Barked: Sun Apr 1, '12 7:10am PST


	yes kiera i agree with everything you say..exept they fight more than other dogs... not one of my own five pit's were fighters...misty was a fighter..... she would drive me nuts with her dominance and her fights with other dominant dogs. i had two boys,they have never fougth...they would be attacked by dogs...i never understoot why,but dogs would alwyas attack them. my own experience with dogs is that those little snappers(small dogs)as i always call them,always would hang in the troats of my dogs.... shayra had her own pet rat and my first pit,a male was in love with my cat,so much that my cat would be totally wet from all that slobbering... and i would have to wash the cat once a week because it was so yukkie from pitbull drool i agree that they must have special owners,that are fit to raise a pitbull(or other big breeds) they need to be raised with strenght and you need to have that alpha mind in you,it's not something you can teach yourself just like that. it must come natural to you as an owner. my very first dog was a rottweiler... don't ask me why,it just was and i never had small dogs.(exept for lotus and man she was a nasty ankle biter) it came natural to me to be a packleader. but i just did not agree what ava,and trust me,i respect ava with her opinions...,that a pitbull is born with a fighting instinct. there is no dog that is born with that treat in them. the reputation a pit has comes because criminals choose them for their crimes and pit fighting rings. if they choose a labrador,you would all own pitbull's and this discussion would be about how agressive labradors are from instinct. pitbull's are ,like kiera says,high enery... thy need lots of exersise and lots of challenge...they love to be busy with sports and walks and other things. a good owner would start with that. in the netherlands we have special pitbull and pit mixes sports like triatlon's with swimming,running and biking... we have games that are adjusted just for their breed here,and it's great... and i guess rules are very very differend in my country. we do not have inclosed dogparks,or do we need to get all kinds of licences to get ito dogparks. here the covermend idea is that,as an owner we are responceble(forgive me if i make spelling mistakes lol)for our own dog and how we raise them. owners confront owners about the behavior of their dogs. police does not interfer in any way in dog matters. unless a dog kills a human,what is so rare here that it almost never happens. our rule in a dogpark is,if your dog can play with the rest,walk around the park and keep away. we all play together,from tiny chi,to the biggest dogs there are.... i look as the us and i see the issues with dogs,bsl laws and dogfighting and i think... what in dogs name is going on there! in the netherlands we are not allowed to own outside dogs...we own house pets...our dogs are inside dogs and if police sees that we chain a dog outside or if it's kept outside we will get a fine as huge as my behind.... we don't have bsl laws,in a fact only pitbull's were banned and they lifted that ban two years ago,because our covermend says it will not change anything,it's not the dog,but the owner! and we have mixed breeds here that are so big that they would eat a pitbull for dinner... as long as we keep the golden rule we have here to make sure a dog is well behaved...we are cool and yes dogs fight,but if the dog is not viscious and owners do not mix into their fights,it's mostly hair you see flying around. dogs,and not just a pitbull...fight,to set rank,territory or status... and all i want to make clear that if the subject pitbull is discussed,not to point out agression right away... they are more than that..... ava...i do understand your point...but pit's and other dogs...are not bred to fight....they are just strong.and in the wrong hands they are like guns..... give a nutcase a gun and there will be victims.

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(retired)min- ister misty

be calm, dont- worry!

Barked: Sun Apr 1, '12 7:20am PST


	Gunther that doesn't mean your chow was born to fight,it was his character to behave like that... not his instinct... misty's character was wanting to be alpha always.... i bought her when she was 11 weeks,two weeks later i was at my vet telling him she wanted to bite me and was agressive. she was a natural guard dog...i could not train it out of her... her property was her property and unless i made sure she was put on her place if friends came over,she would not like it. and she would not accept strangers in any way on her property,she would make sure she was known and i knew well enough she would bite... and it was not that she would maybe bite,she would bite. but she was not viscious. she would walk of leash in the dogpark,she was human friendly if she was not on her own property,she had dog friends and we knew eichother well in our dogpark,so also the dogs misty would have problems with. i had trained her so wel that if i spotted a dog,i could call her to me to come on her leash. some dogs their character's are diffeicult,but i know a lot of dogs with their things and they are not viscious,they just changed their label and their fur..... my pit's were all mellow...they would point out the silver to you if you would break in lol... misty was my most difficuld dog.... and my thought is it came because of her mix but she also saved my life more than once because of her character i was attacked by a bad man in the dogpark when i was walking my dogs...it was summer so it was daylight for long,i think he would had raped me if he was not stopped by misty. i had aburlar in my house once and he met misty,i'm sure he stopt his career as a burglar after that. my brother who has schizofrenia,almost killed me once...it was misty who took him on,not my two pitbull's who were only barking at him.... character and a fighting/killing instinct are two different things Edited by author Sun Apr 1, '12 7:29am PST

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