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This is a place to gain some understanding of dog behavior and to assist people in training their dogs and dealing with common behavior problems, regardless of the method(s) used. This can cover the spectrum from non-aversive to traditional methods of dog training. There are many ways to train a dog. Please avoid aggressive responses, and counter ideas and opinions with which you don't agree with friendly and helpful advice. Please refrain from submitting posts that promote off-topic discussions. Keep in mind that you may be receiving advice from other dog owners and lovers... not professionals. If you have a major problem, always seek the advice of a trainer or behaviorist!


Interesting Article

  
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Kolbe

Where can I run- today?
 
 
Barked: Wed Jul 1, '09 12:47pm PST
Yep... ps I wasn't trying to single you out or anything Kate I just thought your quote was a good jumping point for what I was trying to write.
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ARCHX Asher,- RL1X, RL2X,- RL3

Learning is- changing what we- do
 
 
Barked: Wed Jul 1, '09 1:14pm PST
The questions remains un-answered: what do you do if you see what's going on and you want to avoid a potential escalation?



Well, in the moment, you employ management, which may include pulling the dog away. But that is not going to change the behavior.

But if you want to change the behavior, you turn to training.

If you use dominance as a model, then I guess you would make the dog eat last, walk behind you, keep the dog off the furniture, ignore the dog when you walk into the room. I'm not quite sure how any of these "dominance" oriented things will change dog aggression or reactivity.

If you use yank and crank methodolgy, you would issue corrections and punish the behavior till it ceased. Of course, you have no control over how the dog percieves the punishment and stand a chance of creating a dog that supresses the symptoms of aggression or reactivity until it is too late.

If you decide to use desensitization and classical conditioning, you would expose the dog in question to other dogs, constantly keeping the dog under threashold. Maybe at first you would just feed in order to classically condition a different response to the other dog and gradually move to reinforcing proper responses. You would train appropriate behaviors to take the place of the undesirable ones. This is what I would do, use classical and operant conditioning to train the behaviors I want.

How would YOU address it, Sheila?

How
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Kate

Zoom Zoom
 
 
Barked: Wed Jul 1, '09 1:22pm PST
Kolbe, no worries..I didnt think that!wink
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Kaya

All you need is- love :)
 
 
Barked: Wed Jul 1, '09 1:28pm PST
Taz... no need to be snarky and defensive... pulls what move a lot? Asking a question?

Basically I was addressing the point to the same question the poster just before me had... How does one react. It's not so much about the belief in dominance in in of itself... it's about how one manages and or trains a dog to respond properly. I have no problems with people that utilize this philosophy correctly, however it is my experience among dog owners (much of which are "layman" dog owners that have never sought "professional" help) use the argument of dominance as their argument for basically abusing (though unintentionally and ignorantly) there dogs (and don't read between any lines and assume I am accusing you of being layman or abusive)

So what am I pulling? Stating a point of view and asking a question isn't pulling "tricks" or whatever your suggestion was... what would be the point of that? And what would I be trying to pull anyway? One over on someone? thinking

ETA: I am trying to make the same point Kolbe made, basically... so if she wrote it better... then just read her post and put me as "ditto" afterwards BOL.

Edited by author Wed Jul 1, '09 1:33pm PST

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Kaya

All you need is- love :)
 
 
Barked: Wed Jul 1, '09 1:46pm PST
Oh.. never mind - I realized that was part of MY quote BOL (there were no quotes... threw me off)... sorry about that... I thought you wrote that. wink But the rest of it is my response red face

Edited by author Wed Jul 1, '09 1:48pm PST

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Kate

Zoom Zoom
 
 
Barked: Wed Jul 1, '09 1:49pm PST
Kaya, I think I understand..the fact that people havent the slightest clue about true leadership/dominance..monkey see, monkey do, all without doing their research to find out WHY and in WHAT situations certain exercises or methods are used.

Like laying a horse down..done by a professional, correctly, it is a useful tool on a particular type of horse..but done by a yahoo, incorrectly on the wrong type of horse..its not a training tool.
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Kaya

All you need is- love :)
 
 
Barked: Wed Jul 1, '09 1:53pm PST
Exactly, Kate. I have been with horses a long time, and I wouldn't ever try that... (and would never kid myself to think I could) however yes, I can imagine a circumstance where and able and knowledgeable person were doing so it might be appropriate. Can't think of one off the top of my head, but I am sure there are.

Edited by author Wed Jul 1, '09 1:55pm PST

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Taz - cgc tdi

869092
 
 
Barked: Wed Jul 1, '09 1:57pm PST
I have to admit I'm a little confused by your last posts Kaya, I really wasn't try to get snarky, I was just answering a resource question. Honestly, I've enjoyed your input.
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Kaya

All you need is- love :)
 
 
Barked: Wed Jul 1, '09 2:06pm PST
That's why I apologize... I read that wrong at first red face I didn't see your quotes and sort of read that part too fast and reacted improperly without realizing you were quoting ME... sorry again wink

ETA: reading the quote wrong made me read the response wrong too so sorry for the snark)

Edited by author Wed Jul 1, '09 2:13pm PST

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Taz - cgc tdi

869092
 
 
Barked: Wed Jul 1, '09 2:20pm PST
No problem, I have to admit I've been known to skim through myself. Thanks for taking the time to read what I said and I'll have remember to use quotes so theirs no more misunderstandings.
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